Group: alt.energy.renewable
From: LearningDan
Date: Sunday, August 26, 2007 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: Electrical cars

> Im somewhat surprised that there hasnt been the development and
> publicty given to making electric cars using direct conversion
> gasoline fuel cells.
> Efficiency is much better than burning the gasoline as is done now
> and the dsitribution system would need no change.
> Whilst you are still dependant on oil you would use far less of it
> ,and it would become practical to derive the oil to make the gasoline
> from coal.- Hide quoted text -

Mauried, a very interesting question. If using gasoline to power fuel
cells is feasible (and it seems to me it should be in a gaseous state,
like that used in camping gear) it would make a lot of sense as you
mention*. Your idea got me to do a little search on the web:

"Fuel-cell future for gasoline?" /articles/2000/1st/

"Fuel Cell FAQs" /ipa/

...What sort of fuels can be used in a fuel cell? Fuel cells can run
on a variety of fuels, including hydrogen, methanol, ethanol, natural
gas, and liquefied petroleum gas. Energy from biomass, wind, and solar
sources can also be used. Because they function on such diverse input,
fuel cells are a logical choice to transition from current
technologies to renewable energy sources.

Which type of fuel cell is best? According to a recent study by Arthur
D. Little, Inc., there is no single "winner" that will eclipse other
types of fuel cells because the market for fuel cells is so diverse,
ranging from large utility power plants to automobiles. The attributes
of each fuel cell make it particularly suited to certain applications;
for example, the gasoline fuel cell (when it is developed) will be
most useful in electric cars. Though the hydrogen fuel cell is not
suited to this application, it does not mean that the gasoline fuel
cell is "better." No single type of fuel cell is best; each is suited
to a particular purpose....

"All fueled up and nowhere to go" /069renew_energy/

...Still, there's a problem: Where to get the fuel? While our
infrastructure is built around gasoline, existing fuel cells prefer
hydrogen, methane or propane -- fuels that are a bit hard to find at
the average highway intersection.

Enter an invention by the Epyx division of Arthur D. Little, the
consulting giant. Epyx has figured out a no-moving-parts technology
for disassembling gasoline into hydrogen and carbon.

...the fuel converter separates hydrogen from carbon, and feeds the
hydrogen to an attached fuel cell. The carbon eventually becomes
carbon dioxide. Although the gas is vented to the atmosphere, the
technology should reduce global warming because it's two or three
times as efficient as the internal combustion engine.

"Hydrogen vehicle" /wiki/Hydrogen_vehicle

Low volumetric energy
Instead of storing molecular hydrogen on-board, some have suggested
that using hydrogen reformers to extract the hydrogen from more
traditional fuels including methane, gasoline, and ethanol, or using
reformed gasoline or ethanol to power fuel cells.[citation needed]
However, using gasoline for this purpose would promote continued
dependence on fossil fuels.

"Fuel Cell Technology" /PHandl/
DOE Unveils Breakthrough Method To Power Electric Cars With Gasoline
(10/22/97)

"Social Cost Comparison Among Fuel Cell Vehicle Alternatives (cont.,
P2)" /fuelcell/special/
INTRODUCTION

Gasoline fuel cell vehicles (FCVs) are considered a long-term option
to improve emission performance. Due to the presence of heavier
hydrocarbons in the gasoline, partial oxidation reformers operating at
high temperatures have been developed with some success. Complexity,
cost and onboard size of the gasoline reformer are challenges that
must still be overcome.

and this little blurb form Exxon at
/scitech/leaders/capabilities/

* But even though the gas station infrastructure would make the fuel
readily available, from what I see there seems to still be the problem
of gasoline reformation. And then there's the problems of what happens
to the leftover carbon as well as the continued dependence on fossil
fuels. Though both of these last issues might be rationalized by
calling them necessary interim evils, I'm wondering if it would be
worth it.